Led Black (00:00)
What up everybody, it's Led Black. Welcome to another episode of Uptown Voices. Like I said, it's Led Black and my brother Octavio Blanco. And we have a very, very, very special guest. He is the talk of the nation right now. Mr. Objectionable Art himself. It's funny because I've known you for a long time, Felipe, and you've been such a bulwark of uptown art.

Right. And you you're part of this dynamic duo, you and your wife, Andrea Arroyo to me, our uptown art royalty, like, you know, and but but I really felt better than Andrea instead of you getting this, you know, this this heat in this flack because her work is so like strident and your work is sometimes is more subtle. It's more it's there. You're saying things, but it's more subtle. And for those that don't know, you had a piece of artwork ⁓ that was at the Presente a Latino history of the United in the United States, right. At the.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (00:33)
You

this.

Led Black (00:55)
American,

the Smithsonian Museum of American History, right? Do I got that right? And you had a piece of work that's directly behind you, right? And it was listed on the White House website as objectionable art. And I think your life has probably changed because of that. Like, can you tell us a little bit more about the piece and the whole thing, how that happened?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (00:58)
Yes.

Yes, I created this piece in 1999, which incidentally, I just realized it's the year when I got my US citizenship also. yes, somebody asked me about that when you became a citizen and that's 1999. said, oh, that's the year I created this piece. And it was created basically as a reflection of the immigration situation at that time. And I wanted it

Led Black (01:38)
Wow.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (01:45)
for introduction of a body of work I call Manhatitlan which is combining words of Manhattan and Tenochtitlan, which is the Aztec word for Mexico City. So I wanted to celebrate both cultures, but also acknowledging that a lot of my fellow Mexicans that live in the US maybe have come through the border or they have other means of coming legally or as undocumented, but.

they have been present for a long time. And the immigration policies have always been very politicized. I have been in New York for 42 years. And it's an ongoing discourse. It has been ongoing for centuries, by the way.

And so I made this reflection of how the border looked and the

And I realized these metal planks that were put during the first Bush, President, and later with Clinton, they were surplus from the Iraq war. And they have these metal things because they were made for tanks and trucks to be in the sand during the first Gulf

They have these surplus and they send them to put a fence So I imagine, well,

what would happen if one of them was missing a little piece and these two guys are on the south border looking at the 4th of July fireworks in the US because that's what that always happens and maybe thinking they would like to be there they're not crossing there just as spectators yes and

Led Black (03:16)
That right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (03:18)
because I have seen that in the border. A lot of people just go and look and they say, I would like to go. They don't want to cross. mean, they like to live in Mexico, but they said, how will it be to be there? And also I put a city in the distance in a kind of a golden look. And that also symbolized for me El Dorado. I remember when the Spaniards invaded the...

Led Black (03:39)
Right, the mystical city.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (03:41)
this continent, they were always looking for El Dorado, a place with gold and everything. So that's like a lot of metaphors I was putting on this piece together. later I have been exhibiting it in many places and it has been requested for publications. And finally the Library of Congress realized the importance of this work and that's when they asked me if they could have it for their collection.

Led Black (03:45)
Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (04:07)
I don't know if the Smithsonian, when they were creating the Latino museum, they approached the Library of Congress or me directly. I don't know exactly what was the connection, but they said, we would like to have this piece on this exhibition. And I said, by all means, I'll be glad to have it. And also, and they basically, didn't even.

have it as an exhibition of an art world. was on display in a, it's a long displays of images and words. And they were mentioning, besides my work, they describe what it is. They put a quote about the founding fathers that some of them were, were afraid that there was going to be non white migration to what was the U S back then.

They were, yes, not me. I mean, that was the Smithsonian. Yes, and it's a historical fact. So basically, the museums are supposed to do that. They put historical facts. And even if we don't like it, it's the truth. But for this administration, it's scary for them. And also, the phrase says that, but also says sometimes,

Led Black (04:56)
They put that phrase, not you. Right, the institution did that, not you.

Right.

It's the truth.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (05:25)
we are considered like invaders when in reality we come to work and we embrace the values of this nation. And that's what we want to do as Latinos. And this is the background of this piece. on August 22nd, I remember it was a Friday.

I got an email around 7 o'clock in the morning from a friend, a professor at Forham and also a neighbor from this area. And she said, Felipe, you're in the news. Congratulations. And she put a link to the White House. And I said, what is this? So I clicked the link and I'm like, what? My work is horrible. I mean, I was really, really surprised. At first, I was afraid. I'm not going to.

Octavio Blanco (05:59)
You

Felipe Galindo Feggo (06:10)
the night I said oh my god the White House is is a single me and other artists that were in that exhibition and other exhibitions at the Smithsonian and then I became sad because I said oh my god they're gonna remove it and I said well that's that's what this administration is doing with so many things and later I became angry because I said why are they doing this this is not I mean museums are not supposed to be political

Led Black (06:13)
Singling you out, yeah.

Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (06:40)
Slowly I began, I checked the post from the White House. Then I look at the New York Times and I noticed there was an article about this and I said, maybe that's where my friend got the information. And they mentioned also that this list of objectionable art was also supplied by the Federalist, another online site, very right wing. And the guy who...

Led Black (07:03)
Yeah, yeah, they're...

Felipe Galindo Feggo (07:07)
who wrote that, it used to write on BritBrat, BritBart or something like that. is very conspiracy theories and stuff. What is the seriousness of this? But the White House is always looking for their minions to say something they don't like and they take it as theirs. By this time, Trump a few days before was a...

Led Black (07:11)
Bright Bart, Bright Bart, yeah. Yeah.

Right when garbage up.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (07:35)
is creating the Smithsonian and he did it before, months before he began to attack the Smithsonian. So this was basically a pattern that ended up in this. And I was very worried. said, ⁓ I wanna, have never been to this, to see this exhibition in DC. It has been there three years. And so I said, I gotta go and check it out before, document it before they remove it. So.

I go down there to Washington a few days later and go to the Smithsonian. I mean, it was like this. I found that there was a Greyhound that left from from George Washington bridge at five o'clock in the morning. He said, I got to go that one, take that one, go to the Smithsonian. And I asked for the Latino exhibition and they gave me, they put it in a map and everything. And then I go.

It's closed. I arrived and it's closed. The whole...

Led Black (08:30)
to next year, right?

To next year.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (08:34)
Yes. And I was like, what is this going on? And it's funny because they had a big screen and they had a video which, incidentally, Lin-Manuel Miranda was saying a lot of good things about this Latino area, but it's closed now.

Led Black (08:34)
it's closing definitely.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (08:55)
I began to ask questions. Nobody knew anything. I asked a guard, why is this closed? He I don't know. Don't ask me. I work in another museum. And they sent me here today. I asked other people, I said, who can tell me information about this exhibition? I don't know. don't know. Everybody was, I don't know. I go to the information desk. And they said, let's call a supervisor. He's not answering. So at this point, I realized everybody's afraid. Everybody's very afraid of saying things.

Led Black (09:21)
Yeah, everyone's afraid. Yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (09:23)
of compromising their jobs.

Led Black (09:24)
And the Smithsonian had already caved because there was an impeachment exhibit and they removed Trump's two exhibits, right? But you know, Felipe, this is, you know, one thing I think it's amazing that you're kind of written now into the history of the story in your own little way, right? This will live forever. You know what mean? But it also is very scary, right? Like it's telling.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (09:40)
Yeah.

Yes!

Yeah.

Led Black (09:48)
Right?

Like this is dictatorship. I'll keep saying this like where this is the beginnings of something we've yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (09:51)
No, no, it's very authoritarian. Yes.

And also, it's interesting because I have been getting a lot of requests for interviews. And one writer from the Hyperallergic, which is an online art site, she did a great research. And she found out that this exhibition was supposed to be open until November.

Led Black (10:05)
Yeah, they're great.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (10:16)
and that they closed it in, they say they closed it in July. So I'm not, I don't know if that's true or not. Maybe they closed it after Trump did his declarations later. And then I said, what's going to happen here? And they are saying that they're going to put an exhibition about salsa and that will open in the spring of 2026. Now,

Led Black (10:24)
Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (10:44)
The problem is this, this site that was the devoted in the American History Museum at the Smithsonian was like a sampling of the supposedly Latino museum that is going to be built nearby, like the African American Museum, which is right across, amazing museum. I said, I hope they do something like this for the Latinos. So this was very representative of the Latinos presence in the US for a.

Led Black (10:59)
Right. Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (11:13)
I mean, even if it was small, it's very comprehensive. No, they wanted to close it because they don't want to show it next because next year is the 250th anniversary of the nation. So they want something sanitized. So that's what they're doing an exhibition devoted to salsa, which will open in the spring of next year. And I said, how I've been, I love salsa and everything, but that music or that part of music.

Led Black (11:15)
Right. Right.

Mm-hmm. Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (11:41)
doesn't represent the history of the Latinos, the 64 million of Latinos that live in the US. So it's basically silencing our history. And then I realized all the objectionable art is only from Latino artists and African-American artists. So it's very racist, this administration. And I have been doing a lot of research.

Led Black (11:44)
well.

Right.

Yep.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (12:04)
Trump has never set foot on the Smithsonian Museums and is exploding against them because his minion tells him stories. He has only been once in 2017 when he was president the first time and he was invited because the African Legal Museum received one million visitors already. So it was kind of a celebration back then. And he praised the museum back then. It wasn't changed.

Led Black (12:15)
Mm-hmm.

Good night.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (12:33)
But now basically he's showing his true colors or true color only or non-color.

Led Black (12:39)
Yeah, the orange color, the non-crisp. But you know, it's funny,

Octavio Blanco (12:40)
Hahaha

Led Black (12:43)
I said this on another episode before and Octavio, I laughed about it. I coined the phrase, enjoy it before Trump destroys it, right? And it's happened to you, right? In terms of that thing is destroyed, right?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (12:53)
Wow.

Yep.

Led Black (12:58)
People didn't get the benefit of seeing us in our totality in an important place, right? But I also think that the Latino Museum in general might be in jeopardy, right? It hasn't opened yet. It may not open, you know, and I got to get to the African American Museum because you know from what I've told like what I've been told this is an experience and I know that's gonna go too. how does it feel though like that that in this country at this time this is happening at the with the to the artists?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (13:07)
Yes!

Yes.

Well, by now it surprised me because it... I mean, everything has been a surprise since he took power. mean, and he even said that I'm going to be dictatorship on day one, but it looks like day one is extended. So, I mean, everything he's doing is shocking to the values and the ethics of this country. I mean...

Nothing is sacred for him. I mean, I'm sad. When I was walking towards the Smithsonian, I passed through the Labor Department and he has a huge banner with his face like this and he's saying, American workers first. And I said, I was just reading that. Almost 300,000 federal workers were fired.

Led Black (14:13)
Yeah, very Hitler-like, yeah.

Listen.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (14:24)
And I said, that's that banner is missing a word. It says firing American workers first because he and you have those banners only in totalitarian countries where the president is like looking after you or King. Yes, it and he is. I don't know. It's impressive. He's I always say he said he said he doesn't drink He doesn't smoke. I said, no, he's addicted to himself.

Led Black (14:36)
Bye.

Right, a cult of personality,

Octavio Blanco (14:53)
Hahaha

Led Black (14:54)
He's high on his own supply, that's funny.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (14:56)
no, it's a... So, I mean, I have been reading, I mean, that he wants to have a hand on everything. The Kennedy Center, he fired everybody. Now he's the board, the chairman. So he wants a ⁓ say in everything. And now the arts, it was our turn. I mean, it took longer than I expected, but it's... And also, he goes after humane works because...

Art that is in a museum is not, I mean, it's a reflection. It's a conscience of the nation. So it has to be respected. It's freedom of expression. That's a constitutional right. That's a human right. So it is very shocking. It's very annoying. It's very sad. And it makes me angry also.

to see all this happening to this nation. mean, as I said, I have been 42 years, I was expecting always to go forward, forward, forward, but suddenly this is a backlash to the 1950s or...

Led Black (15:56)
I know more.

Agree.

Octavio Blanco (16:01)
Yeah, ⁓ Felipe...

Felipe Galindo Feggo (16:02)
Yes.

Octavio Blanco (16:02)
⁓

I'm one of the federal workers who was impacted ⁓ by this administration. I was pushed out in February. I was doged by the administration. So, you know, I sort of understand how this affects individuals. I think a lot of folks who might be watching the podcast or have watched you on television doing interviews don't quite understand.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (16:07)
Wow.

Led Black (16:11)
He was doged.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (16:15)
sorry. ⁓

Octavio Blanco (16:29)
just what the feeling is as an individual when you are impacted by the actions of an administration, which is such a sort of like a larger than life idea, the administration, right? It's the government. It makes me think two things. The first question, and if I could, I'm gonna follow up afterwards, but the first question is, has this inspired you to create work? Have you been working?

to create new work since this has happened.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (16:55)
Just a little. to be... I have been requested to write a script for a book, for a graphic novel. I did a graphic novel recently. It came out this year about Ellis Island, by the way. It's a... And I...

Led Black (17:09)
wow, that's amazing.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (17:11)
Macmillan approached me and said, we want you to write a story about Ellis Island I said, for young adults, like a graphic novel. And I said, you want me to write it or to illustrate? no, we want you to write it because you are a, we're assuming your family didn't come through Elisabeth. said, yes, you're right. So you're a neutral voice. Okay. So I did this book, they liked it a lot. And now they ask me for another. I cannot reveal what is the topic, but I'm working on it in the first stages right now.

Led Black (17:38)
wow, it's amazing.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (17:39)
So

this put a really a wrench on my mind. It really took me out of my zone of concentration. So basically I have been doing a lot of interviews, writing a lot, and I have not been able to do much work related to this. I only did a cartoon recently about the firing, about what I saw in Washington.

Led Black (18:04)
Yeah, I saw that.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (18:06)
And I am working on another one about the Trump and the Smithsonian. How is he trying to destroy it? So, I mean, it really, really set me off the rails of my road. So I'm trying to go back. I'm trying to write. I'm because these books involve a lot of research. And now they ask me this book really in half the time that

Octavio Blanco (18:18)
Yeah.

Led Black (18:25)
Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (18:32)
that I used before, so now I'm really working, working, On top of that, a lot of projects and stuff going on, we're having, we're presenting my wife and me an exhibition in Europe, in France, in a Humor Festival in the south of France, at the end of the month, yeah, so we're leaving in two weeks. And it's funny because I didn't...

Led Black (18:50)
That's amazing.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (18:56)
I didn't remember that image of the 4th of July was also published in Paris last year, last November. So I'm going to, I already send them, we have to show this and I have a statement. So I hope to get back my inspiration to do more stuff. But yes, I'm going to continue doing more work. cannot, they cannot silence my voice. it's a, and we, that's like a duty with.

Octavio Blanco (19:13)
Yeah.

No, absolutely.

Led Black (19:25)
Love that.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (19:26)
artist too.

Octavio Blanco (19:27)
If I could also just follow up with a question about, because forgive me, think when you, you're naturalized citizen, right? And you came from Mexico, is that correct? Okay.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (19:35)
Yes.

Mexico, yes. I was born in

a place called Cuernavaca, Mexico, one hour south of Mexico City. And actually I came in 1983. Our plan, came with Andrea. Our plan was to be here six months only. I was going to show my portfolio around and our only connection was a medical student who was studying at Columbia Presbyterian. So we were in Washington Heights back then.

Led Black (19:56)
Yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (20:09)
⁓ We were here for almost three years and then we moved to the East Village and we're back now after 16 years we have been here in this area.

Led Black (20:09)
That's amazing.

Octavio Blanco (20:20)
And so, you know, Mexico is renoun...

I'm Mexican also. born in Mexico City. so Mexico is known for its politics and its corruption and things like that. And so now in the United States, you you expected that becoming a citizen and living here, that the United States is going to move forward. We all expect that to happen. But now that you've seen this, you have?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (20:46)
Yes.

Octavio Blanco (20:50)
you doubt, put some doubt into the institutions of American government? Or do you still sort of feel that we're salvageable, I guess is the way to say it, that we have institutions with checks and balances? Is that something that crosses your mind, whether or not this is sort of the Rubicon?

Led Black (21:04)
you

Felipe Galindo Feggo (21:17)
No, yes,

in a way it crosses the Rubicon because like I said, these 42 years I have seen many administrations and of course some are better than others, but many, I mean the interventions in other countries and things like that are, I mean, it's not something that we will do in Mexico. Mexico.

For example, when I left Mexico, Mexico was okay, let's say, they had economic problems, but there was no violence. Now with the appetite for drugs in the U.S., that really fed money and weapons in Mexico and became a really, really vicious circle of violence. so it, I mean, I blame a lot of the...

of what happened in Mexico and Latin America on the drugs. We have a bit of drugs here. what can I say? I always saw that this way of life in the US and the politics was always balanced. Like you were saying, there is check and balances. The laws were functioning and...

Led Black (22:10)
100%.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (22:24)
Even politicians were really bad and corrupt. There was like a red line that nobody crossed. There was like an honor line. And this guy came and we noticed that on the first ⁓ administration of Trump. At first, he is like, he didn't believe he won. And he already had his plan to counterattack in case Hillary Clinton won, but he was surprised. He was inept and...

Led Black (22:32)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah. ⁓

Felipe Galindo Feggo (22:51)
we could see that in his administration. I don't know if the world sent COVID to get rid of Trump, but we got rid of him. But then the Biden administration had a hard package to follow. this guy kept repeating the lie and the lie and the lie and the lie until a lot of people, I mean, drank the Kool-Aid and voted for him again to give him a, I mean,

So in a way there used to be extremes, right? But this time I think it really broke the wall. It's really, really extreme because when Obama was elected, I was really hopeful for a better... I mean, you went around the world. I would travel a lot when the Bush administration and Iraq and all that happened.

Led Black (23:37)
Right. Mm-hmm.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (23:47)
everybody was hating Americans. When Obama came to power, was like a reconciliation with the US. With Trump, was like, ⁓ no, and then Biden, okay, again. So a respite in the expectations of the world. But now this is really brutal because he went with everything, breaking laws, coming up with emergencies. It's like living in a coup d'etat almost.

Led Black (23:55)
Right.

Right.

Yeah, it definitely is that.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (24:18)
He doesn't care about the law, the rights, the due process, everything that is supposed to be the norm of civil society. He doesn't care at all. ⁓

Led Black (24:30)
But speaking to that, because it bothers the hell out of me that it was a lot of Latinos that voted for this, right? And that's one thing that really hurts, that blows my mind. It's not that I'm willing to excuse white people, right? But I get it, right? If someone's telling you those people are taking your stuff, but when you're those people and you believe that, it's really hurtful, you know? And how do you feel about that? Because it bothers me that there's Puerto Ricans, there's Dominicans, there's Mexicans that support this clown.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (24:34)
Mm.

Yes.

Led Black (24:59)
against us. So they

Felipe Galindo Feggo (25:00)
Yeah.

Led Black (25:03)
voted for a war on their own people, which doesn't make sense to

Felipe Galindo Feggo (25:06)
Yes, it is very contradictory and as I said many people sometimes you see the surface and Fox News and they start believing all these lies they don't question and that's the problem sometimes when people don't question things.

You just take it for granted. And the media was more critical in his first term. Now they are also afraid. And if they give him, they used to question everything he used to say, not anymore. So they take it like face value. And he talks like he's a philosopher. And I always said, why can't somebody ask?

Led Black (25:33)
Not anymore, not anymore.

He's worse. He's worse than ever, yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (25:46)
a tough question. It's like, for example, now with the Smithsonian, can somebody ask him, when was the last time you were at the Smithsonian? mean, basic questions like that, but they're afraid or I don't know. That's it. So I'm very surprised, really. mean, coming from Mexico, I was really expecting. I mean, the whole world used to see the US like a

Led Black (25:58)
No, you're right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (26:09)
an example to follow and you can see that with recycling, the green going green, but now it's going backwards and that's a problem sometimes. hope other societies don't start following this pattern.

Led Black (26:21)
Right?

I agree.

Octavio Blanco (26:22)
you

It'll be interesting when you go to France. I just came back from France. was two weeks there. And one of the things that I noticed was that also in France, I mean, we've seen this in politics, that France is tilting to the right very much. And so it'll be interesting to see what your experience there is going to be with this at this humor conference, because France also has a strong

tradition of freedom of speech. also have

horrible experience with the Charlie Hebdo massacres that happened. And so I do wonder, what do you think this is humor conference, what is the goal or what do you expect to learn from the French and are you concerned? You just mentioned it a little bit about other societies, but are you concerned that Europe is also starting to lean to the right?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (27:22)
I mean, I have been going to France regularly for many years and there, I mean, the right has also a voice. mean, and they're very vocal, but now this woman Le Pen was put in jail because of some corruption practices she did. So that in a way diminish the presence of a voice in the right, but also

They have problems economic problems and and yes, sometimes they have issues with immigration I I mean in Paris you can see it's like a melting pot also and but when you go to the countryside, it's You hardly see that it's a so I don't know Exactly what will happen there? I don't see France going to the right. I think it will stay in the center

And also, one thing you were mentioning, the Charlie Hebdo, I knew one of them, one of the cartoonists. I was a friend of him. So it was really shocking for me when that attack happened. And after that, I began to defend them and defend them freedom of expression. And 10 years later, I never realized I would have to be defending my work from the same thing in the US. It's yes, four places.

Octavio Blanco (28:33)
in the US. Yeah, it's awful.

Led Black (28:35)
Yeah. Have

you got some hate mail? Have you gotten some negative from this?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (28:40)
No,

you know what? It's interesting because for example, there was an article on the Washington Post which has been very criticized because Bezos didn't want to change the editorial line and everything. And I was looking at the comments and they were very supportive. They said, even if I don't agree with that, you have to leave it. Museums are not supposed to be touched. You have to decide for yourself.

Led Black (28:52)
Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (29:05)
museums are to make you think. So I was very surprised and so far I have not received any backlash. And as I said from this image, it's always, it has been always requested because of the significance. during the Obama administration and the Biden administration, the state department commissioned me to do our work for

to give to presidents. I gave an artwork for Presidente Mujica of Uruguay. And then with Biden, they asked me to do something for the King of Spain. ⁓ yeah, if you read the Manhattan Times, they just came out with an article about this. Yeah, so I, and then I said, okay, two administration requests are for me to give as a token of gratitude for their friendships.

Led Black (29:33)
Wow, that's amazing.

that's amazing.

that's really cool.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (29:53)
And this one, this administration banishes me, censors me.

Led Black (29:58)
You can't make that up. I have to ask you though, what did Andrea say? Because I know Andrea must have been pissed.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (30:00)
⁓ She

was really, she has been very supportive. was, like I said, like you were saying, I'm not a person who's on the, I don't want to be in the spotlight, but now suddenly they put me there. So she has been very supportive. She has been giving me a lot of advice.

Led Black (30:07)
Mm-hmm.

Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (30:23)
And she's very smart in that sense of saying, you have to do this, you have to do this, especially you have to make a statement. I said, okay, yes, yes, I'll do that. And so now she, she supports me a lot and I really am very thankful for that. and, and that's what I'm following her advice to say, you cannot hide about this. You have to face it and say, okay, I'm going to honor it and defend freedom of expression and my fellow artists and the Latino community.

Octavio Blanco (30:52)
Yeah.

And I love it that you say that. And I remember Manatitlan. I loved that. I loved that book. ⁓ It was very timely. was right, you know, when New York City saw the big influx of Mexicans from Puebla. I thought that was wonderful. In this show, we've sort of coined a mantra. Number one is spread love. It's the uptown way. And number two is

Felipe Galindo Feggo (30:57)
Thank you.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Thank you.

Octavio Blanco (31:20)
community is the answer. Community is the answer. And so I want to hear about the importance of the Uptown community to you and has it had an impact since you've experienced this really shocking news?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (31:22)
and

Yes,

it's one of the first persons who, when Andrea mentioned this to Niria Gutierrez at NOMAA she was very shocked also and she said we have to do something and she did a beautiful letter of support and she notified also Luis Miranda, which also showed me a lot of support. So the support of this community has been great and also

Led Black (31:51)
Yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (32:02)
I put this case in my social media, which is I only do Facebook and Instagram, which is more or less the same, but I got a lot of support and that was really, really very, very good. I mean, for me, put me at ease a little bit because I'm not going to deny it. Every morning I wake up with anxiety and I have not experienced that since COVID, since the COVID time.

Octavio Blanco (32:26)
Yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (32:29)
So I'm trying to make, I mean, to calm down, but all this support is really important. we have, I was mentioning in 16, we have been here 16 years. Before we live 15 years in the Upper West Side, which apart from an institution called El Taller Latinoamericano, it was like a desert of cultural places.

We knew other artists, but they were musicians, opera singers, something. When we moved to Washington Heights and Uptown it's like we found a new family. It's amazing. I mean, it's a lot of artists. so we are really grateful for being in this part of Manhattan. And we feel embraced and we try to correspond the same way with our work.

So yeah, thank you for all support. mean, Led always supporting me, reposting my work and all that. So I'm very, very, very grateful for that. And that means a lot. It's really calms me down, let's say. Put me at ease a little bit. Because it's, not going to deny it. Sometimes it's very scary. Not for the administration, but for crazies that go.

Led Black (33:28)
off.

Right.

Yeah. And also for the sake of the country, right? Like, you know, you realize when I was in the Dominican Republic, when I come back, you know, you feel like you're losing something that you love a lot. You know what mean? And it's sad. And that's one of the things. it's like...

Felipe Galindo Feggo (33:53)
while for the

Yes.

Yes.

Led Black (34:09)
I can see that anxiety because that email could be something negative, but has there been any upsides besides the community? there been like, you're now more in demand, right? Your work has now more cache or does it?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (34:22)
Well, in a way, yes. I I have had responses from people who want to buy prints from the work, which now is historical. So in that sense, I have had that positive response. And Andrea says, you have to do something else. And I I don't really want to.

to commercialize this. just want, I mean, the support is enough for me. As I said, it's already in many collections, as prints, and people have been requesting, I'm gladly, very grateful that they are doing that. They show me support in that sense. So I don't know how my work will be perceived later on, but I mean, I also...

This put me at another level of exposure that we said I was not expecting, but well, I have to honor it and do my best to, as I said, defend freedom of expression and stop censoring. So I'm going to be working on more pieces. They don't come easy, but I'll try to work on them.

Led Black (35:13)
Right.

Octavio Blanco (35:34)
You know, Latin American art and Mexican art

I'm a big, my family collects taller de graphica popular or has collected so has a strong history or strong legacy of being political, being, of making a statement. But the art world is sort of, I think, split between art that's for the sake of art to make you feel something, but not say a message or not be political versus art that.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (35:42)
Yes.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm.

Octavio Blanco (36:05)
strident and has a political message. Where do you fall in the in what's your feeling about these two?

sort of views about what art is supposed to do. And what message do you want to give to other artists about what their voice means ⁓ in this society, whether it's uptown Manhattan or the United States or globally?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (36:22)
Mm-hmm.

Yes, I'll tell you a little bit of my story. When I went to art school in Mexico in the National University, it was at a time when the time of the Mexican School of Art was kind of...

dormant but also kind of dying because all the main figures already were dying like Frida Kahlo passed away, then Diego Rivera and then the other muralists. there were and the people who were doing that kind of art were just not ⁓ doing something new. And this moment, a lot of artists from Europe came to Mexico.

and they started, and Americans also, and they started promoting the American Abstract School of Art. And this is what we have to do now, not anymore murals or whatever. And I followed that path a little bit. So I was doing abstract art and I like it and everything, I always wanted to do cartooning. So after I finished university, I began to do...

more devoted to cartooning than my art. My art I started leaving it aside and I began to work with political cartoonists and publications. So I was doing a lot of political work in Mexico, but at the same time it was not enough for me. So I wanted to do other stuff and that's when I came to the US to try to sell my ideas. It was more humor for humor, let's say. I had a lot of those ideas.

But once I began to work here, I was doing that, but also I began to get calls to do political art. So I began to do political illustration. And so I said, no, I have to do that because also there were so many things to criticize here in the US and globally also. So I decided to do both things. And then I have other projects like Manhatitlan I come up with projects on my head and I try to do exhibitions and...

So now I have to do that kind of balance. in the, and I always, when I do a work, try to see, I think how this work will read in 20 years or in 30 years. Or it's only, I don't like to do momentary things. I like to do stuff that can transcend the time barriers and international barriers that can be understood in.

China or in France or in the US or in Mexico. So I put that goal in my head and it's a little tough, but sometimes I accomplish sometimes things. So that's the way I think and that's what I hope to continue doing with my work. Going to do just humorous work about everyday life situation, but also about politics and

Led Black (38:57)
Mmm.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (39:22)
stuff that is really, we have to be, we have to empathize with that. For example, I have done a lot of drawings about the dreamers, supporting them. And I have done animations also about Manhatitlan I have one called Manhatitlan Codex in which I reimagine why do they want to migrate to the US. So I have a lot of preoccupations in my mind, but as I said, I

Led Black (39:30)
Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (39:47)
try to make people think and laugh if possible. So that's what has been my goal. And to be informed all the time. We need to be informed and dig deep in the about every situation. A cartoon is at the end a compilation of a lot of sources in one image. So like the expression says, like the phrases, sometimes one image is worth a thousand words.

That's what we aim to do, or that's what I aim to do.

Octavio Blanco (40:19)
That's great, and laughter is such a good way of informing because it diffuses a lot of times. Laughter opens the door for information. We see it in stand-up comedy. It's a really great way to sort of calm it down so that you can deliver a message that's important. So I love that. I think that's important. Yeah, go ahead, Led

Felipe Galindo Feggo (40:21)
Yep.

Yeah

Yeah. Thank you.

Led Black (40:40)
And you know, when

you talk about your work resonating, you know, it's interesting with that particular piece in question, right, how to me, it reminds me there's a song by Juan Luis Guerra the great Dominican, you know, musician called Visa para un sueño.

Right? Right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (40:54)
I'm sorry.

Led Black (40:55)
And then, you know, and the whole song is how, you know, you're going to try to get your papers and he tells you, he describes the process, right? Like, you know, going to, you know, going to the, to the, the, whatever the embassy is in DR and trying to get your papers to come here, right? Cause everything is going to be good when you come here. Right. And I think that's what your, your piece is talking about, right? It's like this kind of, that means every, it's not just Mexicans, right? It's, it's, it's everyone. The whole world has wanted to, to feel that American dream.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (41:19)
Yeah. Yes, it's.

Led Black (41:24)
right? But that was 20 years ago, right? Where are we now? I don't want you to tell me the picture you're going to do, the painting or the draw, but what is the sentiment now for everyone now?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (41:39)
Like I was saying before, I just wish the migration policies were more humane and more practical in a way. Because for example, a lot of people want to come work and then go back to their country. Maybe they would like to do that six months and then go back six months. If they were allowed to do that, no problem. mean, it's so easy to give this kind of visas. It's like temporary visas. They have.

Led Black (41:59)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (42:05)
but they are very limited. as I said, I was even surprised when Reagan gave an amnesty to almost three million people in 1987, I believe or 86. And Bush was going to do the same, but then 9-11 happened. And that really put a cut in the then. And since then, nothing has worked. And what

Led Black (42:15)
Right, yeah.

Octavio Blanco (42:22)
Yes.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (42:32)
Trump is doing is basically very hateful against immigrants. mean treating them as criminals when he knows I mean he knows this country needs immigrants. This is a huge country, very rich country. He's always crying like, oh, we're there. It's like saying, oh, I'm poor, I'm poor, we are poor. No, this is really a rich country and it's rich because of the immigrants that come here and work and do. It's the...

Led Black (42:47)
Yeah.

Right. The country

doesn't, yeah, the country doesn't move without immigrants. It's insane.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (43:00)
No, it's

a... So we just need humane policies, not drastic, it's too draconian and very authoritarian and as I said instilling fear. And I'm glad that a lot of judges are now...

putting a stop on his policies because he declares them like emergency. Like one judge was saying, come on, nobody's, even groups of immigrants, they are not invading the country. They don't have weapons. That's not their goal. mean, come on, give me a break. I mean, this happened yesterday, I think. So I just hope the same way this president was not processed, unfortunately, and go to jail.

Led Black (43:19)
Mm.

Right, yeah, I saw that.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (43:45)
because of the laws, because he has good lawyers working for him. I think the laws might stop him also the same way because they take time, but unfortunately, but they can work. I still have faith that the country will prevail and that this is just a temporary.

sanity or I mean I I will I'm seeing the light at the end of this obscure tunnel that is this administration these years we still have the upcoming elections for Congress and Senate yes so I I'm hoping that people will wake up and and vote and and put them out of the of this

Led Black (44:19)
As of right now, that might change.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (44:30)
this way of governing which is not rational. It's very fearful and autocratic and inhumane.

Octavio Blanco (44:41)
Yeah, and unfortunately, sorry, unfortunately, we do need some better laws in terms of the immigration that, like you say, that are more humane and that are more rational. think one of the things that people don't realize, and you just mentioned it, is that most of the time folks want to come here, work, and then go back. And it used to be easy to do.

Led Black (44:44)
Not good.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (44:46)
Mm-hmm.

Octavio Blanco (45:00)
Before the border was so militarized, there was a flow of people. They would come and work during the season of harvesting, and then they'd go back home when the season of harvesting was over. ever since the border got militarized and got reinforced, it became too hard to do that. So instead of going back home, they decide, we're going to stay here. And so that's the situation that we're in now. ⁓

Felipe Galindo Feggo (45:24)
And also

what I was going to mention, sometimes, and this administration is doing that just looking at the borders, but I mean, millions of immigrants come by plane and stay here. They just don't overextend the visas and they just stay here. and they never look at that. That's another...

Octavio Blanco (45:44)
Yeah, where are all the Canadians being rounded up or the or

Led Black (45:48)
Yeah,

right, no, you're right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (45:50)
But like I said, it's a... And a lot of them managed to make a living and construct better lives, have kids. then they... I mean, it's a... Some generations, I call them the generation that sacrificed for the next one because they are in a tough spot, but their kids are already here and they're gonna be citizens and they're gonna follow a different path. So, I don't know. It's a...

I still have hope that this, that humanity will prevail and mean the reason will prevail here.

Led Black (46:24)
I hope so, know, Felipe, but I don't know. don't know if I believe that anymore. You know, I like, I also think that the world is a different place, right? Before, if America fell, the world will fall with it. I think the world is moving on. You guys have a great president in Mexico. She's amazing, right? She puts Trump in his place all the time. But, you know, I was reading in, I think in Rolling Stone, Paola Ramos wrote a piece about this reverse migration now that's happening. People are going back to their countries.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (46:29)
You

Yes

and

Led Black (46:53)
Right? People are saying, you know what, I don't want to go through that indignity, you know, and I think there's some power in that thing that we can rebuild our countries. You know, what are your thoughts on that? this? Like, because I don't know, like I'm planning something in the Dominican Republic, man. Like, I think I don't I don't I don't trust Trump. I don't think. ⁓

Felipe Galindo Feggo (46:57)
Mm-hmm.

Yes, in a way.

You

Led Black (47:13)
You know, the elections will, if they happen, they won't be fair. I think he's doing things already. think we've already passed, you know, we crossed the Rubicon. think, and they burned, there's no way of getting back. that's my feeling. What are your thoughts on that reverse migration?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (47:27)
Well, yes, many migrants who come here and they have a, experience something different. I hope they try to, to use that in our own countries. And that has happened before because I remember many, many migrants that used to go back, they, will build up stores or help their communities in a different way.

So now it's a little forced, also the conditions, for example, at least in Mexico, the minimum salary has gone up and there is support from the government. I mean, it has helped a lot of the poor people that they don't need to migrate. And that's what I remember Obrador was saying, you don't need to migrate, stay here, work hard. And even they were absorbing many of the people who wanted to come to the US and couldn't make it. They were giving them jobs and helping them out. So.

I hope that that is the case. I have not read much. think there is an article recently, like the one you were saying, how this is impacting their communities. I do hope that. I mean, I don't know how many, numbers of people who have left voluntarily, but I hope if they do, they make a difference.

Led Black (48:24)
Yeah. Yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (48:39)
try to, I mean, at least I think they will still have contacts with people in the US and help each other in that sense.

Led Black (48:39)
Yeah.

Yeah,

that's the new American dream to live in your home country and make American dollars. I think that's what a lot of people are feeling right now. ⁓

Felipe Galindo Feggo (48:54)
you

Octavio Blanco (48:54)
You

Well,

actually, it's the new American dream also for Americans. There's a big problem in Mexico with Americans that are moving to Mexico because they want to they're gentrifying Mexico, but they're still earning American dollars. So it's driving up the rent. It's driving up the prices. It's a whole convoluted situation. And it is fascinating only because it really demonstrates how connected and how easy it is

Felipe Galindo Feggo (49:05)
guys

Led Black (49:07)
That's right. The gentrifying Mexico City, yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (49:13)
Yeah.

Octavio Blanco (49:27)
in this world to move between countries and to with not just because of the jet power airplane but also because now we have like technology like the one that we're utilizing where we can be in our homes you can be in your home and we can have a conversation or we could be doing work and we could be sharing things from across the globe the only thing that really can

Felipe Galindo Feggo (49:31)
and

Yeah.

Yeah, they call them

digital nomads. Yeah, people, I know people in Europe that they are, they're working for the U.S. and they have these visas to be like residents because they are not taking jobs from people in those countries like Portugal, Spain or France or in all over Europe, they have that,

Octavio Blanco (49:53)
Digital nomads, exactly.

Led Black (49:54)
That's right.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (50:13)
that kind of visa and they earn in dollars and they spend it in those countries. So in a way it's beneficial for both sides and you live a different way of life. Maybe it's less stressful than being in visa, but not everybody has that chance. but as I said, I hope those who are going back, they have some opportunity to still be participants with the U.S. in a way.

Led Black (50:26)
Yeah.

And Felipe, we spend a lot of time kind of talking about this, but tell us what you have on the horizon, what's coming out now, what can we expect, where can people find your work?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (50:50)
Yes, well as I said I have to write this book. I have a deadline until the end of the year.

We're going to this exhibition in France as I said, and then we're gonna have one here at the Mexican Consulate they have a gallery and they invited me and Andrea to have one in November. I would probably have Manhatitlan I will show Manhatitlan again. It's a good way and a good moment to revisit it because of the immigration situation.

also more in the future, I will continue doing my work and continue doing more critical work now. have more like another duty to do this, to continue doing this. Did I answer your question or there was something missing?

Led Black (51:37)
Yeah,

yeah, no, you definitely did. how many cartoons do you have as a New Yorker cartoon? Do you have a lot? Is too many to count?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (51:45)
I

don't keep count. I have thousands of cartoons. I and an illustration so it's I invite you to to visit my website is the triple w w w w fego feggo.com

Or you can just put feggo.com and it will take you there. My Instagram is @feggorama with double G. By the way, my pen name comes from my three names, Felipe Galindo Gomez. So I made a compressed version. No, I made that up when I began to do cartoons in Mexico. My first cartoons were published in 1978.

Led Black (52:20)
⁓ Fago, I like that. Was that your nickname though? Is that they called you growing up, Fago?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (52:32)
That's a tradition in Latin America to have a pen name because we have regular names. I have the same name as my dad's right so it's easier to do a pen name So that's where you can see my work and also I'm gonna I there another student a film student did a small documentary about my work I'm gonna I'm gonna put it on my website. I still have not put it there so you can you can see

Led Black (52:37)
Right.

that's amazing.

⁓

we would love to see that. We would definitely share it, man. I'm looking forward to that. It's funny you hear about a pen name, right? Because that's the reason my name is Led, right? Because my given name is Leo, right? Leo, but on my block, Leo rhymes with peo right? So they started calling me Leo peo right? And I was like, I'm not gonna be Leo peo my whole life. So I became Led since the third grade. So I also, I understand the pen name. So that's hilarious.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (53:01)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Leo,

You

No. ⁓

I like your name,

Led Black (53:27)
Yeah, yeah.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (53:27)
let's settle in

Octavio Blanco (53:30)
Yeah, are interesting. I went, this is something that most people don't know unless you're in my family, but my father's Mexican, my mother's American, and my name is Octavio Andres. And they were afraid that I was gonna be, you know, pick, ⁓

Felipe Galindo Feggo (53:41)
Mm-hmm.

Octavio Blanco (53:46)
that I was gonna be picked on with a Spanish sounding name. So they Americanized Andres to Andrew. So for most of my youth, I went by Andrew. But when I went to college, I reclaimed my Octavio. And so I like it better too, I think. But you know, it's interesting because there is that fear that because of my Spanish name, that I'd be, you know.

Led Black (53:52)
⁓

Felipe Galindo Feggo (53:59)
That's all.

Led Black (53:59)
I like Otavio yeah.

Octavio Blanco (54:09)
you know, either picked on by the students or that the teachers wouldn't treat me fairly, you know. So there was a real fear. Felipe, do you have any last words that you want to leave with our viewers who are interested in knowing about this incident and how it's affecting you and how should people respond? Is there a message that you want to send to the audience?

Felipe Galindo Feggo (54:35)
Yes, well, sometimes life throws you a ball and you have to catch it and make a good game out of it because otherwise it's a... I mean, especially in these times, it's a challenge that was thrown to me.

So I have to take it and and and as I said defend freedom of expression and not let our voices be silence because I think art art is powerful and it's very we have to do it and to to Artists out there. I I suggest the same. mean always fight for your for your art and for freedom of expression and and to the general population, let's let's

vote to have a better life in the future, not live in fear under an regime.

that doesn't follow laws, only fear and retribution. That's not the American way of life, especially now that we're gonna have the birthday of the nation next year, 250 years. I mean, we have to change things. And think, mean, a lot, inform yourself, think, and make the right decisions.

for the best for you and for the community because that's how we live. We live in a community and we have to support each other.

Led Black (55:46)
Yeah.

They say that 250 years is the shelf life of most empires. I think this one is coming to a close. know, but Felipe, you know, I really want to thank you though. Like, you know, because again, I know this isn't easy, right? Like, you know, you're an artist, right? You're doing work and you've been doing your work for a long time and to be on the front lines, to not, not to say you're not scared, but to still confront it head on. I have to thank you for that. have to be commended for that. And also for Andrea, right? Like you guys have been

Felipe Galindo Feggo (55:57)
Really?

Octavio Blanco (56:01)
Ha

ha!

Felipe Galindo Feggo (56:04)
Thank

Yes, thank you.

Led Black (56:23)
this powerhouse couple and you you mean you guys both mean a lot to Uptown for the arts of town and you know this community is always going to have your back and you know thank you for putting up the good fight right like we don't know where this is going to go but you you know that we that we love you guys and we support you.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (56:27)
Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Thank you very much. It's really, really nice to hear that. And vice versa. We're there for, we're here for the community as well.

Octavio Blanco (56:46)
Thank you, thank you, thank you. Okay, okay, so nice to meet you too.

Led Black (56:46)
Thank you so much, Felipe. Appreciate it, man. Thank you, brother.

Felipe Galindo Feggo (56:49)
Thank you. Very nice to meet you, Octavio.